Sethians, the Root Shen, and the "Was" Sacred Pillar

Greetings to everyone,

I was wondering if there could be any type of special connection between Seth, the tactics of the Red Order of Seth, and the Root Shen.

Although some could say that this is pure coincidence, I find the fact that the Root Shen corresponds to Red (or Black), and Seth's order is the "Red" Order, to be extremely revealing. My suspition – which I would like to confirm (or not) with your comments – is that the essence of Seth could be related to an unwillingness to spiritually evolve (and as such, to awaken the Serpent Power of the Kundalini), and the desire for Self-Centered Power (the characteristics of a ill-balanced Root Shen). Besides, the "Was" Sacred Pillar also has the typhonian head of Seth on its top.

What is your opinion about this? Any comment will be most welcome!

Regards,
Heru P.K.

You posted the question before I could, but I am glad you did. I am also eager to see the answers to this question since I have been asking myself the same thing ever since I found out that the root shen corresponds to the Was scepter. Hmmm.....

Hello Heru Par Krath.

I do not agree with you on that. Althought it is difficult to make assumptions when comparing symbols from different traditions and cultures, and my sources are primary "typhonian left hand path", usually the color of Set is red and it is so because, as far as I know, red is the color of power.

So I wouldn´t compare "this red" to the red of the muladhara chakra / root shen (which, according to some sources, it is yellow, symbolizing the earth, and not red, by the way).

As soon as I have a little more time I will give you a more complex answer, as I have some books on Set and Typhonian magic that I will read in the following days.

Have a nice day and Xeper-I-Set !

Greetings RudraShiva,

I agree with you that there are alternate LHP systems that give different meanings to Set, his color red, and even the color of the Muladhara Chakra (or Root Shen). However, the question I posted was posted here because this is a specific forum dedicated to the study of Asetianism, and as such that is the point of view according to which I made the former considerations.

If you open the Asetian Bible in the page in which the Asetian Tree of Life, showing the genealogy of the Gods, appears, you'll see that Set's symbol is the "Was" Sacred Pillar (as you said, a symbol of Power). So, consider this (but remember that I'm referring to Asetianism, not other traditions):

- The symbol of Seth is the "Was" scepter;
- The symbol of the Root Shen is the "Was" scepter;
- The two colors associated with the Root Shen are Red and Black;
- And finally, there is the Red Order of Seth.

To me, all of this doesn't appear to be a mere coincidence of meanings and correspondences. If we take Aset to be the representative of the "Higher Self" of every Asetian (and as such, representative of the Crown Shen, corresponding to the Ankh, a symbol of Eternal Life), and Seth to be it's opposite, then Seth could be specifically related to the Root Shen and its characteristics of self-centered interest and egotistic thirst for power (when it's unbalanced). On one hand we would then have Aset, symbolic of Spiritual Evolution and Awakening of the Kundalini, and on the other hand we would have Seth, symbolic of the refusal to spiritually evolve, in which the Kundalini becomes trapped in the Root Shen: in a spiritual sense, "sleeping".

This makes perfect sense to me, but that's exactly the reason why I asked other people's opinion on this subject. I also believe that even you can see some logic in this conclusion, remembering that we're talking about the Asetian Tradition *only*.

Regards,
Heru P.K.

Hi Heru Par Krath.

Her Par Krath wrote:However, the question I posted was posted here because this is a specific forum dedicated to the study of Asetianism, and as such that is the point of view according to which I made the former considerations.

Yes I know, in fact, after writing my post I realized that, maybe, my post didn´t make much sense when seen from that perspective.

But still and although your logic makes sense, I wouldn´t make that relantionship between those symbols. Even if Seth is related to the root shen, that wouldn´t mean that He would represent materialism and spiritual atrophy. The chakras or shens are not about "good" and "evil" and definitely they should not be seen and understood from any kind of tribal mentality. In fact all of them are necessary for your spiritual evolution, as the Kundalini must pass through all of them.

Although I do not know about the Asetian perspective on the shen centers, the chakras are understood as energy centers that "represent" not only your subjective reality, not only your "anatomy", but also the external world too. It is not the root/muladhara center which causes materialism, it is the individual itself who does.

Instead I would suggest that the red color is associated with Seth, as is the Was symbol , because these "things" represent part of His essence (in the same way that the deserts, the Northern realms and the storms do, for example). Therefore I would say that Seth is the god of power and might, a very violent and chaotic being.

You're very right, RudraShiva, and I agree with everything you said about the Shens / Chakras.

Concerning Set, on a personal level my opinion on Him is quite different from the one supported in Asetianism: I would even say opposite.

To me, Set represents unpredictable Chaos, Rage and Antinomianism... and in a gnostic sense, the necessary Hostility towards established (that is, "divine" – in a mundane religious sense) Order: in a word, that which allows us to escape the influence of Slave Gods and become Gods ourselves. This, of course, means that I don't see Set as a symbol of spiritual atrophy and blindness, but precisely the opposite. In a curious twist, I would see Set more or less like Asetians see Aset in their own belief system. No offense intended to anyone! lol

But now let's get back to the topic.
Thanks for your replies, RudraShiva!

You are welcome

Heru Par Krath wrote:You're very right, RudraShiva, and I agree with everything you said about the Shens / Chakras.

Concerning Set, on a personal level my opinion on Him is quite different from the one supported in Asetianism: I would even say opposite.

To me, Set represents unpredictable Chaos, Rage and Antinomianism... and in a gnostic sense, the necessary Hostility towards established (that is, "divine" – in a mundane religious sense) Order: in a word, that which allows us to escape the influence of Slave Gods and become Gods ourselves. This, of course, means that I don't see Set as a symbol of spiritual atrophy and blindness, but precisely the opposite. In a curious twist, I would see Set more or less like Asetians see Aset in their own belief system. No offense intended to anyone! lol

But now let's get back to the topic.
Thanks for your replies, RudraShiva!

I believe the issue here to be related with the fact that the Asetians do not seem to portrait Seth as a representation of an energy or force, it is far more than just an archetype within their theology. Like you said, you see Seth as a representation of several things, like chaos, rage and freedom, however in Asetianism Seth is not a representation. They see Seth as a real entity, like Aset, and not as an archetype. Within their tradition, Seth did not represent X or Y, but was a very real entity, and one that fought against them during all of their existence. So this makes it utterly impossible to compare to how any other traditions, cults or personal beliefs see Seth as an archetype.

Did it make any sense?

It would be like saying that Satanists see Satan as the personification of personal indulgence and unlimited self, but then comparing it to a Christian sect that sees Satan not as any representation, but as a real entity of evil. Both views can't be compared in spiritual terms. Although this was not the best parallel for this situation... lol

Oh and just an important detail. In the Asetian history, Seth is the one who by the means of lies and deceit promotes the slavery towards Godhood, or towards One God. Sethianism is the force behind Monotheism and blind dogma, being the true religious slavery of mankind, unlike the path of Aset that would focus on the power of the Self, spiritual development and personal enlightenment. Being Aset and the Asetians who have fought against the blindness of one single God and only Universal force that would lock their souls religiously. Again, I am speaking in terms of the Asetian theology and how I interpret their scriptures.

Greetings Jonathan,

I perfectly understand what you mean, and agree with you on the difference between "my" concept of Set as an archetype, and Asetians' concept of Aset and Seth as real entities.

However, I'm curious about one thing and would like to post you a question: do you believe that the Asetian Cosmogony (see the Book of Nun, etc) should be taken as "real" – that is, real *facts*, concerning real deities and real historical events – or as metaphors, symbolical allegories whose purpose is to encode hidden teachings? I'm asking this because I've always had some problems with accepting religious creeds as "facts". I'm sure you understand what I mean.

I totally understand what you mean, and the answer to that question is also a bit clouded in my mind. Ultimately I believe that in the end, the truth may be a mix of yes and no. I say this because the Asetians have the habit of mixing both reality and myth in ways to keep real mysteries hidden, so we never know. While I do believe that parts of their mythology certainly is just that... myth, I also think that not all of the Book of Nun is just a tale to pass hidden teachings. In the case of Ancient Egyptian history it is well known that old, but real, situations were passed down generation after generation, later becoming legend and myth. Some Egyptologists believe that the tales of the Gods and Goddesses retold at the walls of many temples and in countless papyrus might very well be their ways to portrait ancient situations that were part of their history, as they saw it in the dynastic periods but as happened in the pre-dynastic. As we all know, the Asetians tie themselves to a period known as the Sep Tepy, which is a far older period in Ancient Egyptian history, and one that we barely know anything about given that all records were lost in time. This leaves an open window for the fact that many of the later dynastic myths can very well be the ways how mankind saw the Asetian existence from old ages, and of course like every other history and myth, it was changed and adapted by the ones telling the stories or interpreting it. This would explain why would so many Asetians and Sethians (according to their teachings) be later represented as Gods and Goddeses, because that was the way mankind found to represent and see their former rulers and powerful beings of magick and deep spirituality.

What do you think?

The AntiCosmic Satanists believe that a cosmic being, called God, Marduk, Zeus or whatever, is responsible for the creation of the Universe (not only the physical reality, but the whole of existence) and so, he is also responsible for the enslaving of our spirit.

Is this a metaphor or is it "real"?

Is there "a being" out there, flying on the sky, above the clouds, watching his creation?

Well, the answer, in my opinion, is yes and...no.

I think it is important to have in mind that, when talking about spiritual things, we must acknowledge the fact that there are varios levels of reality. If Set(h) was a person, a historical figure, in my opinion the whole "Epic Wars" could be reduced to political matters! Just the fight for a kingdom that, nowadays, doesn´t even exist anymore!

However is Set was the embodiment of something "spiritual"...well, things are different, aren´t they? The problem is that in spirituality, archetypes are NOT "psychological realities". THEY exist and so we do.

The question would be if this "archetypal energy" (for the lack of a better term) has some kind of consciousness. I would think so, however this kind of consciousness must be beyond our level of comprenhension. Definitely, they do not think in terms of human logic and rationality.

And obviously, they must be a-moral.

What we experience in this world is the result of previous levels of manifestation. In spirituality, a "psychological reality" CAN´T be seen as that, because then we would be into materialism. An archetype, althought psychological, althought expresing itself through us, must have a reality beyond the whole "psychological thing".

So, in this case, I would suggest that Set, his essence, his "energy", his "being" , his "archetype",must have incarnated in this world during the Set Tepy period, in the same way Aset did. And probably he is still doing it. And so, it is a real metaphor.

Finally, it is important to have in mind that an "archetype" is not limited to just one body or human being. He/she can manifest in a group of people, even in a civilization.

Sorry for my bad english, in my previous post I wanted to say:

"He/she can manifest in a group of people, even AS a civilization"

The meaning is quite different, isn´t it?

[quote="Jonathan"]

Heru Par Krath wrote:

It would be like saying that Satanists see Satan as the personification of personal indulgence and unlimited self, but then comparing it to a Christian sect that sees Satan not as any representation, but as a real entity of evil. Both views can't be compared in spiritual terms. Although this was not the best parallel for this situation... lol

That's a really good example.

I wondered about that too. I mean the root shen is associated with the primal instincts for survival, the needs of the physical body. Which Set represents in their negative forms.
Other Gods were shown holding the Was scepter as well, like Amun, I don't know but I always took that to symbolize the mastery of all that Set peresents. Just as Set was made to bend down for Osiris to sit on him.
I'm not sure im right or not, Im trying to aply myself to understand the symbols of the Shen centres.