Tolerance and acceptance

Part of my own growing has lead me to become all the more passive in regards to what others want to believe and to take more of an 'I don't care' approach which leads to greater tolerance. I don't care about proving "right" anymore. "Truth" is subjective and it is an individuals choice to believe what is true and what is not true for Self as people will believe as they wish regardless. The point, hopefully, is to grow- develop and advance, and each individual journey will be unique and of his or her own trials and errors which we cannot interfere or influence which is more important than being "right." If someone wants to learn more about TOV (for example) then let them seek. Some will find it fake, some will find the AK fake, and some may believe in the tooth fairy-- hell, it doesn't matter. All are free to believe as ye will! All that matters is the 'right of belief' of the individual.

As far as TOV or Belinger, or "this" or "that" group goes, I don't give a damn. All are free to believe as they will. If we (we in general) continue to express how wrong "this" or "that" group is then that makes us sound no different from say Christians who preach about how their religion is right-- whom many will bash against them for that very reason. Think about it, we see this thinking all over the vampire community and in the general population. Though, all are free to speak as they will. Protecting the freedom of belief, the freedom of choice, the freedom of speech-- protecting freedom is what honestly matters.

If we honestly think about it....it is curious that in the Vampire Community--we see all the time how "X" group bashes "Y" group and vice/versa, and how one is right and the other is wrong (I have done this--I am of fault) and in this I am including various vampire beliefs, be it religious nature, or the history and origins, the "psy" v/s "sang" silliness and so on. It seems to me (and I only speak for Self) that there is far less tolerance in the vampire community (I am no fan of the vampire community at large) than there is in the occult community at large. In the occult community at large, there is more tolerance and acceptance on a larger scale than in the vampire community. But why is that? How does that reflect on the people as a whole? What statement does it make? How does that present the vampire community to logical seekers?

Everyone (society at large) thinks everyone else is ignorant and wrong until one goes within and begins to face and own up to ones own ignorance. All are free to walk the steps they choose on their journeys. Every journey is unique and with purpose which contributes to the beauty of diversity. I will just throw this out there....If the TOV (or who/whatever) is approached here with a 'they are fake/bad/full of crapola' tone, then those who seek their knowledge or even those who are TOV (for example) and wish to seek the knowledge expressed here and learn more about the AK, then we are not painting or proving a welcoming and accepting painting/point of view towards others who have different beliefs. Asetianism is all about FREEDOM, all are free to believe and peruse what ever they choose. This must be remembered, honored and expressed which is far more important to spread, than to bash XYZ groups or people which only contributes to the spreading of negativity. And I say these reflective words form a place of humbleness, and with admittance of having done the same.

"Yet, oh aspirant, let thy victories bring thee not Vanity, for with increase of Knowledge should come increase of Wisdom. He who knoweth little, thinketh he knoweth much; but he who knoweth much hath learned his own ignorance. Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? There is more hope of a fool, than of him." Liber Librae

Truth is Relative.

Maxx

N. Augusta.

I am sorry for not being able to address your post above when I read it earlier. I now have time to return and say how glad I am to see something has touched your emotions enough to get you back on the forum with your posting. We all can learn from your talents as I see you have listed your walk in life as a writer. We need your talents to help us see the various sides of all issues. Please address us more often.

I do love your illustrations that you give us on how not to turn away those members of the tov that might have interest here.

I will, however, have to state the reason for my reply regarding the tov in another area. I have been continually contacted in private messages here as well as yahoo messenger and also my old e mail addresses with questions about the tov and my experience there. After a while it seems that there are many out there that "do care" from their viewpoint. I do have to reply to them with my feelings (which I suspect you would also if you had been through those things which they have experienced). I know you see what I am speaking of as each of us has a different view of things around us and how we inter act with them.....as well are all very different even as we appear in the same surroundings.

To be indifferent to such an experience I witnessed from within and thus be enlightened by the actual effects of the tov by incidents taking place behind the scenes that connect to anxiety, depression, and even suicide by some members of the tov, is hard for me to pass over and let remain silent. Having seen first hand conclave meetings with over 20 members at one time in my home, I can actually speak about viewing these members and their problems they carried with them. I suppose I am just a little bit sensitive and wanting to stop these problems from having an effect on others that might be in a position to see this for themselves at the gate of entry to the tov. I suppose I care just a little too much and wish to maybe "hinder a virus from entering some computer" or stopping a "bacteria to enter a healthy body".

I have been told that Nemo attempted to contact the Aset Ka and make movement to join the two groups but the Aset Ka will not even reply to him, which says a great deal about the situation.

But again, I love you taking the time to speak out on something you strongly feel about and I compliment you on your writing style. Many things you state have much merit and I certainly agree with you.

And again, please come out more often and post as you are a most valued member and I always look forward to hearing what you say.

Maxx

That was a nice post N.Augusta. I can understand your reasoning and agree with you, but I also sympathize with what Maxx has said. I do think it's important how we present ourselves and that the whole negativity of criticizing others only promotes further negativity and doesn't echo well on the true path of the Asetians. That makes sense and I'm guilty of that as well so I thank you for taking your time to remind us of such from time to time. But I must also say that as followers of the occult and students in general it's also our obligation to point out scams when we see them. I may not give a damn about them, but if I bring awareness over those situations it's in the hope that I can help other people not falling in their traps. On the other hand I defend that we must experience some of those situations to learn as Maxx pointed out, but if we can use our experiences to prevent suffering in others I will gladly do so.

Bringing some of the crap found in the VC to the light of day, as it has been exposed in this forum on numerous occasions, is something useful for every student out there. Even if it may seem negative or unneeded drama sometimes, it also serves a higher purpose that is to protect students like us and to expose truth. I do agree that at times the way we do it could be more polished, again I am also guilty of that, but we can't remove the negativity of the world by staying silent with the crap and lies we see happening all around us. Sometimes it's also good to take a stance and let the world know how we feel.

Clearly... I agree with Maxx and Jonathan.

I am glad to see on this forum instead of flaming, adult conversation over what may be a sensitive topic. I have noticed soo much finger pointing and labeling Pseudo vampire/satanist, it only makes one realize they are just human irregardless of their pretentious titles they come up with.

When there are a limited amount of organizations that fall under authoritative titles such the church, temple, religion etc..., one is willing to put up with the bull shit while completely ignoring ones bull shit meter or better instincts and intelligence. Often times an organization is a lot like an abusive person who seems docile and harmless at first, but after a hand full of sneaky passive aggressive suggestions and such, one eventually finds ones self bothered and obsessed over the petty relationship, weather it is an organization or and individual. If this organization is like this I really appreciate your candor on the matter. I hope you will continue to share your experiences, if it is actually the case.

It's not that who's right or who's wrong approach you should be shunning but the proving part, solely, that needs to be dismissed from your life and your actions.

The current "problem" with the VC is that it's edgy and cool, so with that it brings "dabblers" and dabblers have no place in the occult. Various sects, cults, and people have seen this and will do what they can to capitalize upon that. This all will pass and back into the shadows we will go, where we can enjoy our intelligent discussions and practice our arts in peacefulness.

When it's all said an done, the foreword of the AB really said a great many things in it's few words. This path is not meant for everyone, nor is it meant for everyone that thinks they are ready for it, or even decides to follow it for a short while. It takes a strong will, one that is certainly strong enough to see these false prophets, and fakes at either first glances or, at least soon enough before too much damage is done.

Whether not or a person decides to become a watch guard against these types of manipulators is a personal choice. It is a choice that carries a very specific set of responsibilities and like the LHP is not meant for everyone, not even all those that chose to follow it. It's a very delicate art to warn without being condescending, but when it can be done it is a valuable assets to the general populace as a whole.

I have spent the last few days reviewing the history of this forum personally, from why certain members were banned and why certain members left, to how certain members are a great asset to this forum and how they greatly effect threads they chose to comment on. From that I have gathered the ruling body of this forum doesn't let shit slinging get to far before it is shut down, which is great in this day and age of the internet where trolling and flaming is almost a national pass time.

While we all delve into it from time to time, many if not all who do quickly resent their actions of flaming which shows a great amount about this specific community. This community really have nothing to prove, nor do we in general care who or what you follow, but if you ask our opinion of something then we will not be afraid to give it.

At the end of it all I believe this thread can be summed up accordingly.

There is a great beauty and balance in pushing your passion to it's limit, yet having nothing to prove. It is this balance that is overlooked on a constant basis. When this balance is executed the end result or product shines and stands above all else because it reflects a true and complete passion. One that is not obscured by one-upsmanship and being the best, but one that not only makes the one that created it happy but shows the world a complete and true product of the soul of the person creating it. It becomes an expression of the passion yet is careful not to be consumed by the childish pursuit of beating or racing others who, in reality, were never part of the race...

This was a beautiful message, DCxMagus. Very well written. I liked knowing that you were to relive the whole forum and that you give our real value is earned.

Thank you.

It is my opinion, that information makes for better decisions. When members come from other organizations and take the time to relate their own experiences, personal ones I might add, then the reader can have a birds eye view from another perspective. Does that mean that the individual who might be interested in the ToV , Cos, or even the RoS should not join and find out for themselves? No it does not. However, if one takes the information, as much as they can find, then one can make a more "conscious" decision.

I am of the opinion, that forums such as this, where individuals are willing to share their very personal experiences holds a great deal of value for any. In sharing, there are no attacks that are personal.....only tales told from journeys of a solitary soul. It is in remembering that all truths are formed on an individual basis which are brought about on a very personal level. Each mind being just a little different.

As far as organizations goes....my question has always been....does one and only one hold all that is needed to ascend? I hardly think so. We grow and should we find that we stop, well then we naturally start to seek out new information, regardless of where it might be, to get back on the road of ascending. It is a pitfall to get caught up in the social aspects of any given organization or forum.

Simply put, it is in the doing rather than the speculating that matters. This is very personal as it takes the actions of the individual and not of a group. So in conclusion, I take into consideration another person's experience as it generally causes me to investigate areas that perhaps I had not thought about prior.

Maxx, thank you for your kind words! I greatly appreciate them. I do love how you are open and do share so much here and always have so much to contribute

Jonathan, thank you for your response too and I do understand your pov, but also do enjoy that you too are open and will openly be reflective.

Witchmark, thank you also for your response, and I do agree with the points you made as well.

I know I brought up something that there really are two sides to.

I did use the TOV as an example only, not to stir up any emotions. I just hope that nothing I said came across as judgmental for that was not my intention. I struggle with expression at times and with how to get a view out there that doesn't come across as judgmental even when I do not mean to.

I totally understand the point about wanting to have information out there that can warn and help others which is done with good intention, but ultimately, it is up to someone to discover for Self what may or may not work for Self, be it spiritually related, who one dates, what job to take, how to manage ones fiances, political and so on. If someone does not agree with or ignores our words of warning--can we thus conclude they are idiots or look down upon them for not agreeing with and following our words of warning of what we feel /think is right? Think about it! Have I done this, and come to such conclusions about others? Of course, I am guilty of this and have done it in it whatever topic is at hand-- we all do this at times, though, we are more accepting and understanding, and less likely to judge when it comes to those we know and care for, usually. Now the reason as to why I included other scenarios, is because we really do it in all areas and not just regarding spiritual and or things that have to do with Asetian topics, etc. Our intentions, be they good, but it is also how the intention is approached and delivered that determines if ones intentions come across appropriately and if they will be well received. The thing is, most people will not admit to taking a poor approach and having a poor delivery, because they are "right." If we do this in all areas, which we do, then there is a point at which we come across as self-appointed experts/gurus. Though, also we cannot blindly assume that everyone has good intentions especially when we do not know the person. It is true that we should trust info the most that comes from those we actually do know. I will trust a friend over some random persons post online. For example, I will trust the OTO members I know "in-person" over what I hear someone online say about the OTO who is not in the OTO, though, I also know that their view will be bias and favorable and that I still will need to do a little more digging--which I do. We have a responsibility to Self to make sure/ verify that the information we are receiving is accurate.

Regarding the TOV, for example: if I honestly do not know much about them other than say what I've heard expressed here then should I base an opinion on the TOV based on what others say? Should I take my quest no further down that road, because of what I hear or do I need to do my own investigation? If I inquire outside of here and find more favorable opinions based on others who have favorable experiences then I would find a more well-rounded base in which to start with and can conclude from there to pursue additional information, or not. Though would not my opinion be bias for having been on this path as I favor the Asetian teachings anyway? Of course! Thus, by default, I would already think my way is the "Right" way. Does it mean it is the "right" way? It may be the right way for me, yet, totally wrong for another.

(The same scenario could be applied to someone looking for Asetian information and or even one who is TOV or follower) If I brought that here (the positive comments and opinions on the TOV)
and discussed them, then they would not be received well and would be knocked down, due to everyone here following Asetianism and being bias by default naturally. Honestly, yes, and because there is an overall dislike for TOV here. So then, would it be concluded that I am an idiot if I decided to pursue more on the TOV and follow their way? Honestly, it would be concluded that I am an idiot for it because of bias opinions. (Well, many Christians would argue that I am an idiot for leaving that path and studying the occult in general. Some would say that my practice with reiki and meditation connects me to demons. ) And really, this is just human nature. (And no I am not trying to strike at anyone-- just trying being logical and neutral.) The thing is, the TOV is no threat to any of us. (Again, just an example.) Now, I have no interest in the TOV-- I did research on them long ago, and that is just not my cup of tea-- though if it works for someone else, then that is fine-- I don't care. Honestly, I have no business bashing them and feel it better to follow my morals of being open and accepting to all, regardless of their paths/beliefs and my own bias opinions, rather than allow my dislikes/prejudices to be at the forefront, which, in fact, by allowing my dislikes to run my choices of actions then I would be displaying and expressing nothing more than closed-mindedness and would in fact be poorly displaying a proper reflection of Self. (You see, I am working on all of this as well as 'i work on Self, and as I expressed with different scenarios above, this really applies to everything.)

How many here, aside from Maxx who was involved with TOV, have actually done extensive research on the TOV? Well, I didn't waste much time looking into them as it was not for me. How many, honestly, base their dislike and prejudices for TOV based on the negative things others have said here? Will you or will you not argue passionately when your views are based on what you've heard from others? If you will do that with TOV, then what other areas/subjects/topics will you also argue passionately against when your argument is based primarily on what you've "heard"? And if you will do that, then how does that make you any different than the ones in the VC who argue against and bash the AK based on what they have heard? We can conclude their intentions are also good. It is illogical to base arguments on what we have heard rather than what we have learned, and again, this applies to everything. Now, I expect nobody to answer these questions-- they were given for thought only. ( Really, I could apply this same scenario to laundry detergent, or what have you, though, that would be boring, really.)

In all honesty--Maxx has a totally legitimate reason to have a deep dislike for his former path-- he's "been there and done that" and there often is a healing process that takes place when our paths are changed.
I am a recovering Christian and sometimes, I do have to check myself with my own thoughts which may, at times, be Christian like thinking. IF I focus on bashing Christianity and speaking out against it and try to change the minds of those whom are Christians, then they will get defensive and I will have accomplished nothing more than making myself look like a horrid sinner/idiot in their view. In actuality I will have accomplished nothing more than wasting my energy and feeding into negativity even though my intentions were good. As many know, my best friend is a born-again Christian, and her views are out there and fear-based, though, she feels she is right and following Gods word, and her intentions are good. We just agree to disagree on spiritual/occult/Chrisitan topics. She posted this video (I am including) on her FB and shared how wrong she thinks yoga and meditation are, I've argued many times otherwise with her, but she stands strong hold to her belief, which is totally fine, and in some way, even admirable. Honestly, she is the most anxious person I've ever met and it has taken tole on her body for years. Here is the video...Hell just look at the title and notice comments are disabled. I just had to share this, for such things fascinate me, yet make me mad/sad and laugh at the same time. People will believe as they will, you can warn them, they may or may not listen, but it is best to not judge. Don't quote me, but I think meditation is mentioned somewhere in the bible and that one of the "good guys" meditated.

I have a friend who is a former TOV and he values things he learned from it, but decided it wasn't for him. He looked into this path, but based on many opinions he saw expressed here (not regarding the TOV) turned him off to even finishing his reading of AB. I've explained many times that the views expressed here do not represent the AK, but he remains turned off by what he saw here. Now this is only one example, there are more I am sure. The truth of the matter is that this forum represents the public face of the path, and there is an obligation to represent it properly, I think. With that said-- no more attention needs to be given to the TOV as there are pages and pages already here. So when a new person comes around, don't feed into it and send them to read such threads, close the thread. And the same applies to Bellinger and the VC at large. I know, people come all the time asking or adding on to such topics-- but it is all negative-- and our energies do not need to be spent there. I know, I know, I cannot tell people what to do--but that is a suggestion that I think should be given some thought. The exercises you guys are doing now are wonderful! Positive and helpful! And by doing such things-- that will attract more serious learners. Keep up the good work and the sharing! I am happy to see the forum go in that new direction. Again, I only represent myself here.

I have really enjoyed the responses-- it is important to have them, it is important to share, and most importantly-- they prove that all intentions are good-- and anyone now can read and see them which is a good thing. My intention here on this thread, have been good and solely to encourage thought. We are all right, though, we are all wrong in someones eyes, that's life!

And here is the video-- have a chuckle! I will see you, my fellow sinners, in "Satans playground" Are you ready? Notice how comments are disabled.

Sorry, for the part above which was repetitive in regards to the video--that didn't come out right. I'm outside with the sun and working on a black screen page-- well, pasting/typing, is not exactly the best idea to do outside, especially when still working on my first cup of coffee.

And Maxx, please take nothing I said as in me speaking for you-- I wasn't trying to, and hope it did not come across that way.

Also, my use of examples are nothing more than things we can relate to here, because everyone is "right" and with "good intentions" no matter the subject matter, no matter the group of people, no matter the individual. Well, not every man on Earth has good intentions, of course.

I really do appreciate everyone's contributions, thank you!

Excellent post, N. Augusta. When I woke this morning at 5 am I was told by my spirit that you had posted.....but it did not tell me how fantastic your post was....and this just confirms what I had written earlier that we need more of your posting here.
Please let us hear more of your input about......everything.

My comment about what you addressed is something I have said several times from my own viewpoint.......everyone is exactly where they are capable of being in their walk through this lifetime. Their own belief system lines up with everything they have experienced through all the other lifetimes they have experienced. All souls need something to believe in for comfort within the mind. This will conform with their concept of what they experience as "truth". That certainly will be very different for many others that are here to experience their own walk. Also, it will conform to many others and what their walk will involve. That is why I look at this whole scene as so remarkable in how the mind creates so many different learning scenes for each of us. And I would love to hear what Talibah was referencing in another posting in relation to this.

Again, an excellent post of creating a mental scene for each of us and explaining a complicated situation and making it more down to earth. I know everyone can associate with what you have said and learn from it.



Maxx

I really enjoyed reading DCxMagus and witchmark's posts in this thread. N.Augusta also brought up some valid points on how we represent this path. Of course in reality we represent nothing and this forum is only a small outpost of Asetian knowledge, one of many places and certainly not one seen as authoritative.
As for your friend, I don't think anyone should read or not read the AB based on what they read online or are told by their friends, but as you said, each will do as they please and that is fine. Maybe he/she just wasn't ready yet for this knowledge and someday will be.

MAxx, thank you! And that is really cool how you knew about how my posting was gonna be today. And I totally agree with the points you raised on your post, thank you!

Jonathan, about my friend, I totally agree!
While we here are not some authenticated and official authoritative people/forum in regards to the path, but the fact is, this is the only place that the "public" really have to refer to, and the people will and do look here. There are like 899 members, though, 99% are silent. :S But what/where else does the "public" have access to? The AB, the AK website, here, and? Those are the only things that I know to refer people to who do wish to learn more, though I do inform them that the forum is not an official place.

Well, look at that! Okay, I stand corrected, 900 members it is then. ))))

I do not know if I like or not the post of N. I personally do not see things as "good" or "bad." I like to see this kind of path as Honor. Happiness depends on our effort and dedication, anyone can be happy if want and here no one can question what makes certain people happy. A Christian, an Islam, a Buddhist, or even an atheist, have the right to be happy... the same happens in the occult world, the vampiric communities, among all others. They all deserve to be happy. The point here is when people are easy to negotiate, I mean, when they go to a particular religion or group, and only speak well and are dedicated to her, after a long time they exchange of religion /group and speak badly of their experience and of course the new group they follow is right and the old was a misery, a wrong path. What kind of Honor is here? It's like I invite you to my house, you eat my food, and then when you go out of my house you speak ill of my house and my food .. but while you were inside it .. Only speaking well of me and my house... then, you find something new and better food and my house no longer useful. This is Interest! This is what happens to most of the world. Many say nice words, do nice things .. but this is only an illusion of reality. We must honor our word, our feelings, and above all, we should be happy with our choices. As I mentioned above .. I accept the path of everyone, I respect the beliefs and mainly I admire the Honor of who never give up of their feelings. This is admirable and hard for the world and I have a great admiration for those who fight through life and only win big disappointments ... never gave up to obtain the final result in their lifes...
There is no True Happiness without Honor. Honor is just a small part of peace.....

N.Augusta wrote:Well, look at that! Okay, I stand corrected, 900 members it is then. ))))

I really don't get what's up with all the people that register here and just stand silent looking at us. There are always a lot of people watching this forum but most of them don't interact with us. People are weird! Or maybe we're just too sexy to look at.

Stalker wrote:The point here is when people are easy to negotiate, I mean, when they go to a particular religion or group, and only speak well and are dedicated to her, after a long time they exchange of religion /group and speak badly of their experience and of course the new group they follow is right and the old was a misery, a wrong path. What kind of Honor is here? It's like I invite you to my house, you eat my food, and then when you go out of my house you speak ill of my house and my food .. but while you were inside it .. Only speaking well of me and my house... then, you find something new and better food and my house no longer useful. This is Interest!

I think I get what you mean and I'm also with you on this one. What you describe is driven by lack of personality or like an occultist would say, a lack of defined Self. Most people have no identity, being only part of the herd, so they follow what others say and do, finding it great at the time, but when others change they go along with them. I know that N.Augusta might not like my usage of the word herd and see it as unneeded bashing, but I think it accurately describes many people.

As for me and as most of you know I used to be a Pagan before getting deeper into the LHP and studying Asetianism. I still honor my previous path and everything I learned in it. I feel it was a needed road that made me ready to reach Asetianism and being able to cherish it and understand it better. I would never start insulting a former path just because it's no longer cool or because my friends found a new "occult hobby". I also don't get it when people act in such a way but I do agree it's a common thing. Like I said above it's a lack of Self and identity.
Who cares anyways...

Thank you, Jonathan.

Jonathan wrote:As for me and as most of you know I used to be a Pagan before getting deeper into the LHP and studying Asetianism. I still honor my previous path and everything I learned in it. I feel it was a needed road that made me ready to reach Asetianism and being able to cherish it and understand it better. I would never start insulting a former path just because it's no longer cool or because my friends found a new "occult hobby". I also don't get it when people act in such a way but I do agree it's a common thing. Like I said above it's a lack of Self and identity.
Who cares anyways...

Beautiful. In fact, I have this idea about you and I am glad for listen this by your words. Thank you again. People like you, I greatly value. I believe too that here are many users with the same feeling than us.

just 2 quick things I will post here....the first in regard to N. Augusta's original post about all the "Vampire" use of titles all over the net....which I had one time thought I might belong in that group. It was due to my drawing energy from others as I walked by them or drew it from them on purpose. As the Asetian Bible states, any human can learn such a technique.....and I suppose I was one that drew energy because my body needed to replenish it. The Bible says that is often the case.

I consider myself one of those humans....and not a Vampire. The Asetian Bible says there is that classification...but I do not consider myself as being in that group. I am just a plain ole normal human being and I am here at the opening statement on this site saying that even humans are welcome here. So those that lurk outside the forum and never post because you think you need to be Vampire.....do not be concerned. Come on in. Humans can do grand things with the tools that have been given to work with, so I will continue to try and develop. As Victor said, he thinks all are welcome within the spiritual realm of the pyramid as long as they do not have adverse thoughts against the Asetians.

The second is an open note to Stalker as I know he works in energy work such as reiki.....and anyone else that would love to understand healing.A great book I found is called "cell level healing" by Joyce Whiteley Hawkes. One thing I found different there is that she speaks of a core cylinder of color just above the spine that shows different colors in everyone. It indicates the condition of the energy flow and extends upwards through the head and out the crown point. This is the first I had ever seen of someone seeing this as a means to help in healing others while working on them to improve their healing. Most books of this kind speak of working with the aura but this one goes beyond that. But it is a simple and grand book to show how healing the cells in the body will eliminate the sickness within the person. It can be ordered from Amazon or downloaded into Kindle.

Maxx

Thanks for the suggestion, Maxx. I'll take a look and then give you my feedback.

@Jonathan, Lol, yes, that's it "we're just too sexy to look at." Hehehe. I don't get it either! 900 members,yet so few speak. It is just weird! "Herd" hehe nah I do not like that word, either.

Your assumption is correct in my not liking the word "herd." Honestly, though, most often what I see is the word being used by people to bash others for acting like a "herd"-- yet often the one using the word also acts herd-like, though, they may come from a different herd. Lol! Life is full of irony! And, no, I'm not saying that you are, but I am sure you have seen this too.

@Stalker: Stalker, it doesn't matter if you like my post or if you do not. What matters is to encourage and exchange thoughts. I wasn't speaking about happiness and honor, but if that is the direction of thought that you took it, then, okay.

I agree that all people 'have a right to be happy.' Happiness, though, it is not always easy to come by, yet, at the same time, we choose what makes us happy and what doesn't, and honestly, life experience is a contributing factor in what does or does not make us happy. Though, I think life is more complicated than 'anyone can be happy if they want' and that it requires more than "want" for there are many variables/complications that arise in ones life, and we cannot be happy all the time. It is easier to be happy for the man that requires little. I really think happiness is easier to find in simplicity. Often we can learn so much from those who have less. But remember, not all men are free in this world, just look at the people in Sudan.

As far as people switching paths. You may see it as something bad, and dishonorable, but can we honestly conclude it is? (I am going to give you some food for thought, which you may agree or disagree with, but please do not take it negatively for that is not my intention. Things just are not always so black and white/ cut and dry.)

Are not all free to do as they will? Yes! "Man has the right to live by his own law— to live in the way that he wills to do..." Liber LXXVII Finding ones "right place" is not an easy task! <--Every man has a journey to find his place. Everyone has a different/individual path to walk that is full of all sorts of different lessons, twists and turns. And, life is short, yet we also have responsibilities, etc. that do require our attention, so we can't just live being solely focused on our spiritual paths, though, it sure would be easier in that regards if we lived in caves. The thing is, we are always changing as we grow. What may of worked for us at one point in our lives, may not work for us later on. That's fine! Everyone who is an Asetianist, came from some other path prior to walking this path. Both you and I, and others left Christianity. Have you not bashed Christianity? Yes, you have! Have I? Yes, I have! Does that make us horrible and dishonorable? It shows why that path did not work for us, and shows what we were seeing wrong and what and why it no longer worked for us, in a nutshell. So no, it does not make us horrible or dishonorable. Are we going to live every moment of our lives in honor? No! Will all of our actions and words be honorable? No! Can we judge others for changing paths when we have done that ourselves? Wouldn't that be hypocritical? No matter what path one leaves--there is a recovery process and how that is handled, how long it takes to recover is an individual and personal thing. How one manages, handles and approaches that recovery, will vary. Can you honestly say that you will be on this path in 10, 20, 40 years from now? Honestly, can you? Who knows? Maybe I will have been able to travel to the countries I want to by then, but maybe not. We can't say what will or will not happen, as life is always changing, ya know? As life progresses, we unlock other parts of ourselves which contributes to change. I am not the same person I was 10 years ago, and I am glad that I have grown and wish to continue to grow. Well, hmm, think about it, if one stays their entire life on one path (remember not all paths are open to learning knowledge outside of the path/religion) then what they will learn in their life will be limited according to the teachings of that particular path. As a former Christian, I am very familiar with that, and am glad to have removed those chains. With that said, there are things from it that I learned that I continue to value as it did help in molding me into who I am today. Most of all, I am thankful that I learned compassion. It is much easier to be cold and closed-off than to be compassionate and open, ya know?

Anyway, just food for thought!

Thank you for your reply N.Augusta.

I will reveal you a secret, let me talk a little about myself, please. I believe in Love, in Loyalty and in Honor as I mentioned many times. My belief is not based on "If's" or the Asetianism was a choice I made to follow.. Asetianism is part of me, part of my thoughts and feelings. Asetianism makes me complete. The cycle of life is very simple, you live, you die, you return to incarnate and you turns to be educated in the tradition and philosophy of your new parents. But, there's one thing you cannot forget: Your past. You have a tendency to pick your past, your choices will be based on what you lived in your past life, is not as linear as well, but generally works well. I can give you an example of a singer or even a writer, in past lives were the professions of them and in this life will have a strong tendency to be singers or writers ... This passion come from the soul not the physical pleasure.

The Bushido was an Honor code of the Samurais, a code of conduct and living style and the Samurai was a very proud person, so that his name be dishonored he would perform seppuku, because in their code of ethics it's better to die with honor than live without it. As Eriotto Rongu said one day..: “Any man can be prepared to kill, a samurai is prepared to die”.
So you're telling me it is not possible to live every moment of our lives with Honor? The Samurai is just one example. The era of the samurai ended in Japan, but they exist and are real ... Only live differently.
What about the Asetian Family? Together for more than 8,000 years as Family, life after life, Honoring Family Bond, fighting for their Union and fighting together for the same purpose. Not live an Honorable life? All the time means nothing?

One thing is to be off and not realize how to listen our inner voice and Soul ... another thing is to have power of choice, freedom and it still does not honor their commitment. I did not choose to be a Christian, was my family who baptized me, forced me to take communion and confirmation. After I listened my inner voice and have obtained the freedom, I realized where I really belonged accepting the option and beliefs of others and walk my path without doubts.
Life is a game, or a jungle. We must know how to play and live. Fortunately I was born in a place where I can express myself more and get faster results than if I had to live in Sudan or anywhere else. In this life they are having problems of freedom .. The next could be me or you. Therefore, it is very important to survive in the jungle .... because you never know what may come in the future to the jungle. Caution is always the best option.

Jonathan, was very clear in what he said in his post.

Jonathan wrote:lack of personality or like an occultist would say, a lack of defined Self. Most people have no identity, being only part of the herd, so they follow what others say and do, finding it great at the time, but when others change they go along with them.

I agree with both Stalker and Jonathan.

The mind is a trap, which almost all of us fall into. The trick is not believing you are living a free life, full of free choices...the trick is recognising this trap and working a way out of it.
The mind wants us to be docile. Society wants us to be docile. The mind IS society. The choices we make, are NOT free...they are a succession of directions designed to keep us compliant.

Separate the mind from the soul, and therein you will begin to find true Freedom.
Enlightened beings know this.

...I am not suggesting that I 'know this' or that I am enlightened...but we do not need to look any further than the Asetian Bible to see evidence of this truth.

*banging head against desk*

I wrote a ridiculously long post on this thread and lost it by mistake. Now I don't have time to re-write. Well, I guess this is an opportunity to rethink my words when I do find the time.